Seriously people. There are thousands of us on this list that use it FOR REAL. Some one having an issue with degraded Netflix streaming or they can't pull up their Facebook page is an abuse of this fine instrument we have for REAL problems. Fibers cuts, Level3 ATM switches going down, EC2 AZ problems, etc. are real and service affecting to those of us that run networks and companies. Not one person's evening entertainment quality being reduced. Can I please propose that we police ourselves enough to know that if what we are posting doesn't affect a large populous OR isn't germain to our livelihoods (network admins, techs, engineers, NOC personnel at any common carrier or ISP, etc) that it not be posted? Today, any email from OUTAGES commands attention, respect and is a community, voluntary call to action -- like ringing the bell in an old west town. Let's please keep it that way. _____________________________________________ Cheers, Mike Sent from a thingy connected to the interwebs. Paul Stewart <paul@paulstewart.org> wrote: Are you referring to me answering or the OP? The "guys, come on" part I find kind of offensive! I understand your point and yes I should have paid more attention to the posting - will give you that. I'm quite familiar with their infrastructure. But wasting a full paragraph on his wife cooking vs just getting to the point would have created a lot less noise on this list too. Paul Stewart -----Original Message----- From: Bill Nash [mailto:billn@billn.net] Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2011 10:01 PM To: Paul Stewart Cc: Raman Sud; outages@outages.org Subject: Re: [outages] Netflix Guys, come on. You can't be serious with this. It's like you're skipping even basic troubleshooting or identification of a potential problem entirely. Knowing Raman, he sent this from his couch because he saw a little degradation while streaming an episode of Entourage. Nevermind that in his time zone, it's near dinner time, his TV's media unit is probably on wireless, and his wife is more than likely cooking dinner. Heating up a side dish is no reason to assume there's a network outage or degradation that could possibly be noticed all the way to Canada. Netflix's service infrastructure is a varied beast that involves Amazon's cloud services and no less than two CDNs, if not three. Make the effort, instead of making noise. - billn On Sun, Aug 14, 2011 at 3:35 AM, Paul Stewart <paul@paulstewart.org> wrote:
No issues from Toronto, ON Canada...
Paul
From: outages-bounces@outages.org [mailto:outages-bounces@outages.org] On Behalf Of Raman Sud Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2011 2:37 AM To: outages@outages.org Subject: [outages] Netflix
Seeing a lot of latency and bad streaming from netflix from phoenix.
Any one else seeing problems
Sent from my Android phone using TouchDown (www.nitrodesk.com<http://www.nitrodesk.com>)
_______________________________________________ Outages mailing list Outages@outages.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/outages
-- - billn _______________________________________________ Outages mailing list Outages@outages.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/outages
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael R. Self" <michael.self@phonefusion.com>
Seriously people. There are thousands of us on this list that use it FOR REAL. Some one having an issue with degraded Netflix streaming or they can't pull up their Facebook page is an abuse of this fine instrument we have for REAL problems.
Fibers cuts, Level3 ATM switches going down, EC2 AZ problems, etc. are real and service affecting to those of us that run networks and companies. Not one person's evening entertainment quality being reduced.
Can I please propose that we police ourselves enough to know that if what we are posting doesn't affect a large populous OR isn't germain to our livelihoods (network admins, techs, engineers, NOC personnel at any common carrier or ISP, etc) that it not be posted?
Well, our 'charter' (posted on the wiki), says: """ Our primary focus tends to be Critical Internet Infrastructure such as IXPs, DNS root servers, major carriers, major data center, carrier hotel, COs, etc., related outages, but other sorts of things -- telecom/BlackBerry problems, AIM dying again, etc -- are certainly within our scope here as well. For years many have argued “what constitutes critical infrastructure”. A single clear cut definition has yet to be devised. Infrastructure is constantly changing; a moving target, so to speak, and what's important to one may not be as important to others. You are welcome to adopt whatever definition of 'criticality' you like. """ We've discussed in the past the fact that eyeball networks contain lots of paying customers who do, in fact, care if they can't get to Netflix or Facebook, and that their money makes the issue on-topic for this list. That said, I will agree that a *bit* more investigation is called for, both by people who are inquiring, and people who are reporting for good or ill. Please see my next posting on that point.
Today, any email from OUTAGES commands attention, respect and is a community, voluntary call to action -- like ringing the bell in an old west town. Let's please keep it that way.
Excellent viewpoint. Cheers, -- jra -- Jay R. Ashworth Baylink jra@baylink.com Designer The Things I Think RFC 2100 Ashworth & Associates http://baylink.pitas.com 2000 Land Rover DII St Petersburg FL USA http://photo.imageinc.us +1 727 647 1274
Something that causes a lot of phone calls by end users. A service impact that end users experience. Netflix being down is worth posting. One stream that buffered for a moment at one location is NOT. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Mon, Aug 15, 2011 at 10:32 AM, Jay Ashworth <jra@baylink.com> wrote:
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael R. Self" <michael.self@phonefusion.com>
Seriously people. There are thousands of us on this list that use it FOR REAL. Some one having an issue with degraded Netflix streaming or they can't pull up their Facebook page is an abuse of this fine instrument we have for REAL problems.
Fibers cuts, Level3 ATM switches going down, EC2 AZ problems, etc. are real and service affecting to those of us that run networks and companies. Not one person's evening entertainment quality being reduced.
Can I please propose that we police ourselves enough to know that if what we are posting doesn't affect a large populous OR isn't germain to our livelihoods (network admins, techs, engineers, NOC personnel at any common carrier or ISP, etc) that it not be posted?
Well, our 'charter' (posted on the wiki), says:
""" Our primary focus tends to be Critical Internet Infrastructure such as IXPs, DNS root servers, major carriers, major data center, carrier hotel, COs, etc., related outages, but other sorts of things -- telecom/BlackBerry problems, AIM dying again, etc -- are certainly within our scope here as well. For years many have argued “what constitutes critical infrastructure”. A single clear cut definition has yet to be devised.
Infrastructure is constantly changing; a moving target, so to speak, and what's important to one may not be as important to others. You are welcome to adopt whatever definition of 'criticality' you like. """
We've discussed in the past the fact that eyeball networks contain lots of paying customers who do, in fact, care if they can't get to Netflix or Facebook, and that their money makes the issue on-topic for this list.
That said, I will agree that a *bit* more investigation is called for, both by people who are inquiring, and people who are reporting for good or ill.
Please see my next posting on that point.
Today, any email from OUTAGES commands attention, respect and is a community, voluntary call to action -- like ringing the bell in an old west town. Let's please keep it that way.
Excellent viewpoint.
Cheers, -- jra -- Jay R. Ashworth Baylink jra@baylink.com Designer The Things I Think RFC 2100 Ashworth & Associates http://baylink.pitas.com 2000 Land Rover DII St Petersburg FL USA http://photo.imageinc.us +1 727 647 1274
_______________________________________________ Outages mailing list Outages@outages.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/outages
Might I suggest that a Criteria be outlined for what constitutes an acceptable post to the outages list if this bothers people so much? That way when someone posts an email. They can simply be redirected to that URL instead of 6 emails upset about the face someone asked if Netflix/Facebook was down for some or all. So far we have: 1. Fiber Cuts 2. Level3 ATM Switches Down 3. Cloud Service outtages (e.g. Amazon EC2) Just a suggestion from a lurker. If it's already been established could I have the link? Thanks, Mike Schuler On Aug 15, 2011, at 9:16 AM, Michael R. Self wrote:
Seriously people. There are thousands of us on this list that use it FOR REAL. Some one having an issue with degraded Netflix streaming or they can't pull up their Facebook page is an abuse of this fine instrument we have for REAL problems.
Fibers cuts, Level3 ATM switches going down, EC2 AZ problems, etc. are real and service affecting to those of us that run networks and companies. Not one person's evening entertainment quality being reduced.
Can I please propose that we police ourselves enough to know that if what we are posting doesn't affect a large populous OR isn't germain to our livelihoods (network admins, techs, engineers, NOC personnel at any common carrier or ISP, etc) that it not be posted?
Today, any email from OUTAGES commands attention, respect and is a community, voluntary call to action -- like ringing the bell in an old west town. Let's please keep it that way.
_____________________________________________ Cheers, Mike
Sent from a thingy connected to the interwebs.
Paul Stewart <paul@paulstewart.org> wrote:
Are you referring to me answering or the OP? The "guys, come on" part I find kind of offensive!
I understand your point and yes I should have paid more attention to the posting - will give you that. I'm quite familiar with their infrastructure. But wasting a full paragraph on his wife cooking vs just getting to the point would have created a lot less noise on this list too.
Paul Stewart
-----Original Message----- From: Bill Nash [mailto:billn@billn.net] Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2011 10:01 PM To: Paul Stewart Cc: Raman Sud; outages@outages.org Subject: Re: [outages] Netflix
Guys, come on. You can't be serious with this. It's like you're skipping even basic troubleshooting or identification of a potential problem entirely. Knowing Raman, he sent this from his couch because he saw a little degradation while streaming an episode of Entourage. Nevermind that in his time zone, it's near dinner time, his TV's media unit is probably on wireless, and his wife is more than likely cooking dinner. Heating up a side dish is no reason to assume there's a network outage or degradation that could possibly be noticed all the way to Canada.
Netflix's service infrastructure is a varied beast that involves Amazon's cloud services and no less than two CDNs, if not three. Make the effort, instead of making noise.
- billn
On Sun, Aug 14, 2011 at 3:35 AM, Paul Stewart <paul@paulstewart.org> wrote:
No issues from Toronto, ON Canada...
Paul
From: outages-bounces@outages.org [mailto:outages-bounces@outages.org] On Behalf Of Raman Sud Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2011 2:37 AM To: outages@outages.org Subject: [outages] Netflix
Seeing a lot of latency and bad streaming from netflix from phoenix.
Any one else seeing problems
Sent from my Android phone using TouchDown (www.nitrodesk.com)
_______________________________________________ Outages mailing list Outages@outages.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/outages
--
- billn
_______________________________________________ Outages mailing list Outages@outages.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/outages _______________________________________________ Outages mailing list Outages@outages.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/outages
Please redirect this thread to outages-discussion. Thanks, Frank From: outages-bounces@outages.org [mailto:outages-bounces@outages.org] On Behalf Of Michael R. Self Sent: Monday, August 15, 2011 9:17 AM To: Paul Stewart; 'Bill Nash' Cc: outages@outages.org Subject: Re: [outages] Netflix Seriously people. There are thousands of us on this list that use it FOR REAL. Some one having an issue with degraded Netflix streaming or they can't pull up their Facebook page is an abuse of this fine instrument we have for REAL problems. Fibers cuts, Level3 ATM switches going down, EC2 AZ problems, etc. are real and service affecting to those of us that run networks and companies. Not one person's evening entertainment quality being reduced. Can I please propose that we police ourselves enough to know that if what we are posting doesn't affect a large populous OR isn't germain to our livelihoods (network admins, techs, engineers, NOC personnel at any common carrier or ISP, etc) that it not be posted? Today, any email from OUTAGES commands attention, respect and is a community, voluntary call to action -- like ringing the bell in an old west town. Let's please keep it that way. _____________________________________________ Cheers, Mike Sent from a thingy connected to the interwebs. Paul Stewart <paul@paulstewart.org> wrote: Are you referring to me answering or the OP? The "guys, come on" part I find kind of offensive! I understand your point and yes I should have paid more attention to the posting - will give you that. I'm quite familiar with their infrastructure. But wasting a full paragraph on his wife cooking vs just getting to the point would have created a lot less noise on this list too. Paul Stewart -----Original Message----- From: Bill Nash [mailto:billn@billn.net] Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2011 10:01 PM To: Paul Stewart Cc: Raman Sud; outages@outages.org Subject: Re: [outages] Netflix Guys, come on. You can't be serious with this. It's like you're skipping even basic troubleshooting or identification of a potential problem entirely. Knowing Raman, he sent this from his couch because he saw a little degradation while streaming an episode of Entourage. Nevermind that in his time zone, it's near dinner time, his TV's media unit is probably on wireless, and his wife is more than likely cooking dinner. Heating up a side dish is no reason to assume there's a network outage or degradation that could possibly be noticed all the way to Canada. Netflix's service infrastructure is a varied beast that involves Amazon's cloud services and no less than two CDNs, if not three. Make the effort, instead of making noise. - billn On Sun, Aug 14, 2011 at 3:35 AM, Paul Stewart <paul@paulstewart.org> wrote:
No issues from Toronto, ON Canada...
Paul
From: outages-bounces@outages.org [mailto:outages-bounces@outages.org] On Behalf Of Raman Sud Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2011 2:37 AM To: outages@outages.org Subject: [outages] Netflix
Seeing a lot of latency and bad streaming from netflix from phoenix.
Any one else seeing problems
Sent from my Android phone using TouchDown (www.nitrodesk.com)
_______________________________________________ Outages mailing list Outages@outages.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/outages
-- - billn _______________________________________________ Outages mailing list Outages@outages.org https://puck.nether.net/mailman/listinfo/outages
participants (5)
-
Frank Bulk -
Jay Ashworth -
Josh Luthman -
Michael R. Self -
Michael Schuler